Logging meat (raw vs cooked)
I've seen a number of threads on how to log meat values (raw vs cooked) and in most cases the recommendation has been to log the cooked weight, unless the food entry specifies that it is raw. However, I'm seeing data that seems to contradict this.
As an example, I wanted to log chicken thighs I got from Costco. Specifically, "Kirkland Signature, Chicken Thighs, Boneless & Skinless" in the cronometer database. For a 4oz serving (presumably cooked, since it doesn't specify raw), this comes in at 130 cal/22g protein/4.5g fat. Using this as a cooked value I had to eat a LOT of thighs (far more than I would normally eat) to hit my protein target, so I started looking around.
My search led me to find "FreeBird, chicken thigh, raw, skinless, boneless, organic", which seemed like an identical item from another brand, though this one explicitly specified raw. In this case, a 4oz raw serving is listed as 131 cal/23 protein/4.1g fat. These values are close enough to the Kirkland Signature brand that I have to assume they are equivalent.
Next, I found "Chicken Thigh, Skin Removed" which is sourced from NCCDB. 4oz of this are 196 cal/31.4g protein/6.8g fat.
Based on all this, it seems like the Kirkland item is actually for raw meat, even though it's not specified, and the last item is likely for cooked. If that's the case, the cooked thighs have ~50% more cals/protein/fat per oz than the raw listings and that means I actually ate ~50% more chicken thighs than I should have last night (which feels about right, honestly)
IMO, it would make things much simpler if the items in the cronometer database were contained the info on whether they are for raw/cooked ingredients.
Comments
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I’ve noticed that USDA will show a standard weight of 3 oz. for cooked meat and 4 oz. for raw meat. I don’t know if this is just coincidence for some of the food I’ve logged or a rule they follow.
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.
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Hi SHaase!
We recommend using the NCCDB when logging foods in Cronometer because they provide the most nutrient data. NCCDB provides the nutrient info for prepared foods, in other words the data is for a cooked serving of meat. If you're looking for raw instead, I recommend searching for a USDA. Search for the name of the meat and add raw at the end.
There is no rule for whether they provide nutrition information for raw meat or cooked meat for brand name products, like Kirkland chicken thighs. It's up to the manufacturer to decide. More often than not. they do not indicate which they have used on the package. Log generic versions in your diary to skip the guessing game.
Karen Stark
cronometer.com
As always, any and all postings here are covered by our T&Cs:
https://forums.cronometer.com/discussion/27/governing-terms-and-disclaimer -
Is there some kind of documented standard users could reference on default assumptions of NCCDB entries and their naming conventions?
Because I am extremely skeptical of that assumption. Because this breaks the recipe feature. When I import a recipe into Cronometer, I'm using a recipe that is calling for raw amounts of ingredients. What's a chili recipe that calls for 3 lb of 85% lean ground beef. If I use the NCCDB entry for that item, but NCCDB is using measurements based on the prepared weight of that item, in the question comes up "prepared how"? Dumping that 3 lb of 85% lean ground beef into my chili recipe, that 15% fat it's also ending up in the final product. If instead I am Browning that meat in the pan and then draining it, a lot of that fat if not most of it is getting thrown away. Not to mention there's moisture loss. So the nutrition for that 3 lb of ground beef is going to be very different in different contexts (raw vs cooked, stewed/braised vs pan cooked and drained vs grilled).
Even the complexity, there has to be some kind of official documented way in which the NCCDB decided to navigate all these fuzzy issues when building and maintaining the database
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There are multiple NCCDB entries for broccoli: raw, cooked from fresh, cooked from frozen. Perfect. Easy. But then if I'm having steak for dinner, there's an entry for sirloin, rib eye, with or without visible fat eaten and ... No options for cooked vs raw, frozen vs fresh, grilled vs pan fried, etc.
Also, if you go out and order a "6 ounce strip steak" that generally means a steak that weighed 6 ounces at time of purchase (raw), they don't weigh it before they serve it to you. So, this just doesn't feel like it adds up to me. I might do some comparative analysis and see how the values line up, but would really appreciate if you guys could obtain and share something official from the NCCDB on their SOP here
