surprise: kiwi fruit sungold contain B12; I am raw vegan without suppelements

Walker

250 g kiwi fruit sungold contain 0,2 microgram B12 (cobalamin), which is 8% of my daily need. This ist very much surprising for me, because fruits normally don't have B12.

I prefer organic food and never wash it. I have not consumed any alcohol, any tea, any coffee, any chocolate, any pommes, any pasta, etc. since 1999. I am raw foodist. I love lots of bananas, all kind of fruits, lots of alfalfa, some greens, raw cauliflower and zucchini, sometimes lentil sprouts, very little amouts of nuts.

Ten years ago I ate lots of** raw mea**t of best quality and some fish, but after some months I became problems, could not hear on one ear, skin troulbes etc. I stopped the raw meat and all problems vanished. Later I tried again raw meat, but I always felt tired the next day, overacidified, emotionally strange. Raw meat tastes excellent for me, but it is better for me to avoid it.

I am more than 60 years old.

I live raw vegan and do not use supplements of any kind, except dried algae (seaweed like dulse) for more than five years. I live in Germany an do not have enough sunshine here. I do not work outside. I have no iron problems, no (visible) symptoms of B12 deficiency and work part time as a teacher for young addults. Mentally and emotionally my condition seems okay.

My body is able to produce some little amout of B12? There is B12 on organic anwashed fruits an vegetables?

starchivore

"...any trace B12 in plants are due to microbial contamination from soil or manure." See 4-minute YouTube video of Dr. John McDougall regarding B12 - http://lanimuelrath.com/do-you-need-to-supplement-vitamin-b12-on-a-plant-based-diet/

Susan_RD_101

@Walker

While some foods MAY contain trace amounts of B12, the amount is unreliable. Furthermore, to maintain levels at ~360 pmol/L (amount recommended for vegans) a daily intake of at least 50 mcg is recommended.

Keep in mind that not all symptoms of B12 are visible; if homocysteine increases (as B12 isn't available to reduce it) there is an increased risk of heart disease. In addition, it's important to note that as we age, our ability to absorb B12 reduces since we produce less stomach acid. Finally, even though our bodies produce some B12, it's too low in the intestine for us to absorb. And the scary thing about B12 is that some of the side effects of deficiency can be permanent; it's just not worth the risk.

While I support eating raw-ish, nutritionally, it can be risky unless you are eating ++++ calories. The bioavailability of protein, iron, and zinc is much lower, so careful attention needs to be given to these nutrients. For anyone following a raw diet, I recommend regular monitoring of: B12, Vitamin D, Zinc, and Iron status.

Typically, if someone wants to eat raw, I suggest making the diet 80-90% raw, but allowing for cooked pulses twice a day.

Kind regards,

mike

Would you be able to provide the recommended daily intake of the following micro nutrients for vegans: Ca, Omega 3, Zn, I (Iodine), you already provided the vegan recommendation for B12. ; or at least provide a reliable source of information.

A vegan source of Ca that contains the carbonate salt of Ca ( as in several vegan 'milks') is unacceptable, and one needs to eat an impractical amount of seeds and beans to reach and maintain a healthful Ca level. The same applies to Zn. Omega 3 is another concern with the added prevalence of low ability to convert ALA to DHA and EPA in humans, as well as the heavy metal contamination of many algae, a vegan source of omega 3.

Perhaps you are able to share a reliable, scientific nutrition information source for vegans.
Thank you

starchivore

There is a lot of information on the internet that answers your question. You won't find any shortcuts by asking on this forum. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOj4rzSkqok

starchivore

Here is a video made within the last year. It answers your question about calcium and Omega 3's. https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=10&v=EW7AzTnxzoo&feature=emb_logo

Susan_RD_101

@mike

Calcium carbonate is slightly less absorbable than citrate, but it is still an acceptable source. And studies confirm that the bioavailability of calcium in plant milks are comparable to dairy milk. In contrast, calcium is actually more bioavailable from many plant sources (such as napa cabbage, okra, bok choy, etc.).

There's still quite a bit of controversy surrounding calcium and the simple fact is nutrition experts aren't sure how much we must get from our diet. We know 400-500 mg is essential for preventing osteoporosis but countries can't agree if 700 or 1000 mg is a better target for adults and it may come down to the individual's dietary pattern and nutritional risk.

I advise vegans to aim for ~800 mg of calcium per day. Given the alkalinity of a vegan diet, absorption tends to be slightly better than on a high protein-omnivorous diet. Along with this, it's essential to consume 1000-2000 IU vitamin D, which ensures that calcium gets properly assimilated.

All omega 3 (including DHA and EPA) is derived from plants; it's just that the fish eat algae and we eat fish. It's true that ALA won't provide enough DHA/EPA due to low conversion and that vegans have lower levels of DHA/EPA in cells compared to omnivores consuming fish. However, studies don't yet tell us what, if any, significance this has. Currently, there are no agreed upon recommendations for daily DHA/EPA but to be safe, I recommend 500 mg algae-based supplements, especially for young children and older adults (who are more likely to experience changes to brain tissue). I also don't think algae would be contaminated since it's purified before sale (and because fish eat algae to obtain DHA, the same issue would be found in fish supplements, if algae were contaminated). To be honest, I'm more concerned with contamination of fish. We have procedures to remove toxins from supplements, but removing them from fish, where they can bioaccumulate, is still an issue.

With zinc, the issue is phytic acid, which can slightly reduce the absorption of this nutrient. I recommend vegans aim for 1.5X the RDA, which is pretty easy to obtain if you are eating sufficient plant protein and including zinc-rich foods like pumpkin seeds, hemp seeds, and wheat germ.

Iodine is more than a vegan issue... Many people aren't actually getting sufficient amounts. This nutrient isn't found in large amounts in the food supply which is why the government (in Canada) fortified table salt with the nutrient. However, the food industry may or may not use iodized salt in their food and people are avoiding the use of salt at home. As a result, I find many people's diets are lacking in iodine. While seaweed can provide adequate amounts, some seaweeds provide excessive amounts. My recommendation is to consume an unprocessed diet and include 1/4 to 1/2 tsp of iodized salt per day to meet requirements.

Hopefully this answers the majority of your questions!

Kind regards,

Walker

Hello Susan_RD_101,
hello starchivore,
hello mike,

I thank you very much for your informations in these posts.
Excuse my english, I am writing from Germany.

Kind regards
"Walker" (Thomas)

Susan_RD_101

@Walker Your English is great!

Walker

Thank you

Walker

@Susan_RD_101

do you recommend cyanocobalamine, methylcobalamine, adenosylcobalaine or hydroxocobalamin or all four of them?

Is cyanocobalamine dangerous because of cyanide?

In a medical periodical I recently I saw an ad of "Ankermann", a German company, promoting very high levels of CYANOCOBALAMINE; orally taken this would go into our system by passive diffusion.

In 2020 you wrote to me regarding vitamin B12.

Within the last ten years my HOMOCYSTEINE went up to a very high level. Three months ago I changed my mind and I started to take cyanocobalamine, methylcobalamine, adenosylcobalaine and hydroxocobalamin using tablets. Within three months my homocystein-level came down to 17. I will continue to supplement B12.

Are there new studies regarding the bioavailability of protein, iron, and zinc?

I am still eating no meat or pork or fish or dairy products or cooked food. I eat sprouted lentils and very very few almonds and nuts. Most of the time I eat all kinds of fruit and sometimes green juices. Eating walnuts or almonds creates problems in my body.

For many years I am on a RAWFOOD diet.

I don't take any medication, no diabetes, no cancer, no hypertension, no obesity, no rheumatism, no arthrosis, no neurodermatitis ...

My AGE level (Advanced Glycation Endproducts) is low, 19,6. I take care of eating more glycose than fructose in my diet.

I am still able to run 6 kilometers every week. I am 67 years young.

I hope you still can answer, after this long intermission.

Excuse my English, I write to you from Germany.